Newspaper Does Not Give Accurate Tram Temperatures

General Palm Springs area.

Newspaper Does Not Give Accurate Tram Temperatures

Postby Perry » Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:09 pm

This has been bothering me for awhile, and I've finally had enough of this nonsense. The newspaper doesn't tell people how cold it really gets up there, possibly because the tram doesn't want to see a decrease in ticket $ales. While this may sound like a "white lie" common to businesses, I have seen many children with cold hands and feet because their parents don't buy them gloves and boots.

Today the front page of the Desert Sun had this article:
http://www.thedesertsun.com/apps/pbcs.d ... 7701150324

The Palm Springs Airport (~500 feet) recorded 24ºF Sunday morning. The tram is at 8,500 feet, but they said it only got down to 13ºF. As most mountain climbers know, there is approximately 3 to 5 degrees temperature drop for every 1,000 feet. I'm also wondering if this was just completely fabricated because the airport recorded 39ºF as the low this morning, but the tram web site said its low was 7ºF, which does sound like an accurate temperature difference.
http://www.crh.noaa.gov/data/obhistory/KPSP.html
http://www.pstramway.com/cams-weather/w ... detail.asp

If anybody is up there, please ask the ranger station what the low was for Sunday morning/Saturday night... Granted, Long Valley (8,400 feet) is slightly colder than the tram because the cold air settles there, but that's where all the kids play in the snow, and difference is about 5 degrees at night when there's no sun.
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Newspaper does not give accurate tram temperatures

Postby Cy Kaicener » Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:46 pm

On Saturday morning the Tramway recorded a record low temperature of 3 degrees F. for the top of the Tramway. The low for Saturday/Sunday must have been almost the same.
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Postby Perry » Tue Jan 16, 2007 3:05 pm

Cy, I'm curious where you got that number. In the desert, Sunday was colder than Saturday. The newspaper said the low on Saturday was 15 degrees, and the forecasts predicted lows of 20 for Saturday and Sunday at the tram. The airport in Palm Springs recorded 24 as the low for Sunday morning. NWS listed 25 as the lowest hourly recording, but the 24 may have come in between two hourly measurements.
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Postby AlanK » Tue Jan 16, 2007 3:24 pm

The PS Tramway Web site has weather data:

http://www.pstramway.com/cams-weather/w ... detail.asp

It lists the following lows:
2 degrees F Saturday
8 degrees F Sunday
7 degrees F today
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Postby Perry » Tue Jan 16, 2007 3:52 pm

Thanks, Alan. Here are more details:

Date Mean
Temp. Max
Temp. Min
Temp. Heat
Deg
Days Cool
Deg
Days Rainfall Avg.
Wind Max
Wind


Jan 12 12°F 26°F 12:01 AM 2°F 10:20 PM 0 52.5 0.00" 9 mph 49 mph 12:01 AM


Jan 13 10°F 19°F 12:50 PM 2°F 3:50 AM 0 55 0.00" 1 mph 14 mph 8:30 PM


Jan 14 17°F 26°F 11:20 AM 8°F 11:40 PM 0 47.5 0.00" 4 mph 26 mph 10:40 AM


Jan 15 17°F 26°F 2:01 PM 7°F 6:10 AM 0 48.5 0.00" 7 mph 31 mph 12:20 PM


I called the Idyllwild Ranger Station, and I was told that 8F was the low recorded at Long Valley Ranger Station on Sunday morning/Saturday night. I would have guessed 0 or -5F.
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Newspaper does not give accurate tram temperatures

Postby Cy Kaicener » Tue Jan 16, 2007 4:26 pm

Perry - 3 degrees F was the temperature posted at the window of the lower tram station ticket booth at 8.30 am on Saturday morning. I would guess that Sunday would be almost as cold.
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Postby Perry » Tue Jan 16, 2007 4:41 pm

Thanks, Cy. In theory, Sunday should have been colder, but the weather can do strange things.

The data on the tram web site is really weird. It says the highs on Jan 11 and Jan 12 occurred at 12:01 AM and there's no low for Sunday morning, only Sunday night.

Wait till you see photos of the newspaper weather sections....
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Postby AlanK » Tue Jan 16, 2007 7:50 pm

"The data on the tram web site is really weird. It says the highs on Jan 11 and Jan 12 occurred at 12:01 AM and there's no low for Sunday morning, only Sunday night. "

That makes sense to me. On the 11th, it was 39 degrees at midnight (and 12:01 AM). It got colder all day, so that was the high. On the 12th, it was 26 degrees at midnight (and 12:01 AM) and again got colder all day. Note that these are consistent with the lows for the 10th and 11th, which came late at night.
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Postby Perry » Tue Jan 16, 2007 11:12 pm

Image

By itself, it could make sense on a graph. It appears that there may have been only a small difference between temperatures in the desert and temperatures on the mountain on Sunday. It is possible that the tram web site and the ranger station number I heard secondhand are both accurate. However, the newspaper has some serious issues.


Monday's Front Page
Image

Article:
Image

Saturday's weather section (Jan 13):
Image
Palm Springs
52/29 Saturday forecast
55/45 Friday observation
Top of Tram
39/20 Saturday forecast
32/19 Friday observation

Sunday's weather section (Jan 14):
Image
Palm Springs
56/32 Sunday forecast
51/39 Saturday observation
Top of Tram
45/20 Sunday forecast
29/15 Saturday observation

Monday's weather section (Jan 15)
Image
Palm Springs
57/34 Monday forecast
52/24 Sunday observation
Top of Tram
46/22 Monday forecast
30/3 Sunday observation

???
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Postby AlanK » Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:35 am

Wow! I agree -- some of those temperatures seem to have come from another planet.
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